Changing out a hot water heater

[Lucky 1]

I noticed that the hot water heater had an installation date that indicated it was 17 years old.
The warranty was 6 years!

I thought maybe I would treat myself and maybe have it done for me.
I called a big company and they sent over an estimator.
Very nice young guy. He saw that it was easy to get to , ground level,
simple installation etc.,.

He said it would cost $2,600 or low ball $1,900!!!
I politely told him my wife and I could not afford that.
My wife helped me to go buy a hot water heater and to install it.
$500 for the hot water heater and change for two new flex copper tubes.

I hope to god they do not pass a law saying you will
not be able to install a hot water heater yourself. Lookout!!

BTW...My wife and I followed all of the latest laws and rules.
I fear that someday no one will be allowed to fix anything inside or outside of their house
without a professional licensed inspection.

[TOOLS1]

I'm with you on this Lucky. However luckily I have a license. In most places the homeowner can still do their own repair work, but they still need a permit, and inspection. However if they pay someone else to do the work, they must be licensed.
TOOLS

[shinyribs]

In my area home owners can repair and replace anything in their home with complete freedom. No inspection,no permits. IN their home. In some more urban areas you need permits to do certain things of certain sizes outside of your house.

IMO (and I am licensed in my profession) licenses and inspections are BS. I fully understand the dangers involved with that,but I am also a big time hater of local govt bleeding us for revenue. But that's just me. I see oodles of licensed contractors doing all kinds of dangerous work. The license doesn't guarantee good work. I also see a lot of inspectors around here that dont know their butt from a hole in the ground.

About 8 years ago one real estate firm called us to replace a furnace in one of their properties. We gave them a price over the phone and they gave us the go-ahead to do it the next day. When we got there the furnace was fine. A home inspector had condemned it for a cracked heat exchanger. We called the real estate firm and told them what was up. There was some confusion and I ended up hanging around (yeah...i got the free time) until the home inspector came out to meet me. He was upset that I was going against his condemned notice. I just told him that I wasn't comfortable condemning a furnace that I knew was perfectly healthy. He asked me how I knew it was healthy so I showed him. "Oh, I always wondered what to look for" he said.



So I asked him,"Wait. You didn't know how to check one out until I showed you? So what basis did you have to condemn this furnace?"   His answer: age.

Long story short: We lost that job. The real estate firm now uses us exclusively. They no longer use that home inspector-ever.

Moral of the story: Honesty pays out in the long run!

I have stories about building inspectors passing things that you wouldn't believe! I also could tell you about some if the insane things they've turned down. I could honestly go on for pages. I just don't trust them. Not the local ones here at least. I don't know what kind of test they have to pass to get their job,but it must involve nothing more than ability to read and write.


Lucky,glad you opted to do it yourself!

[motogrady]

haha, licenses.

Been down that route, a can of worms for sure.
But, move to a place like Preston
County, WestVirginia, where there are no real zoning or permits,
and you'll see some of the most convoluted, half assed work you can imagine.
It's no wonder a ton of the houses out here burn down.

On the other hand, if you follow BOCA and the National Electric Code, and all the others that
come out of the woodwork, many couldn't afford it.
Latest is the ground fault breakers they want in the panel boxes.
What are they, 20, 40 bucks a pop, and they want like half of them to be g/f.

Add that 500 to a storm water management system,
a sprinkler system (yes, some places want sprinklers in residental dwellings),
the hurricane clips, the new hvac stuff ( a 90 plus gas furnace vs an 80, a 13 seer vs a 10),
the fee's the permitting process costs, it goes on and on.

I don't see how people can afford it anymore.

As far as a WATER HEATER, (you don't heat hot water), yea, 2600 is high.
I do them for 8 to a grand.  
But many bid a job, or estimat one with this simple formula.
Materials times 3.
That water heater, maybe 400 bucks.  Add fittings, fuel for the truck, another 100.
500 times 3 is 1500.  And that doesn't include the cute little expantion tank they want.
Which may seem high to an outsider that doesn't see, the taxes and insurance (figure 1/3 the job),
a helper, with all the trappings that go with that, wear and tear of the vehicle,
permit and the time it takes to get one.

At 1500, you're lucky to walk away with 500, which, for all the exposure you incur, isn't that much imo.

Looking at it from a business standpoint, I can see, if your in it to make money, and play by the rules that be, 2 grand is a fair number.

[shinyribs]

^^^This guy gets it!


And on the subject of licenses and what not. We recently had to spend $350 and three evenings after work the ''new'' NEC exam to keep our electrical licenses current. I say ''new'' because it's a known fact that this 2012 exam we currently took (mandatory) is already obsolete. It's the 2012 NEC Exam!!!! This is 2013!!! So, we spend time and money to take this exam to remain legit all because the 2013 exam is not ready yet. Not my fault.


Gov't. They do such a splendid timely job on everything,don't they? Hey,why not let them control our health care?????

[Lucky 1]

I paid $1300.00 to take the 6 hour welding inspectors exam through the American Welding Society.
I passed. Then I found out there was very little chance of getting hired because the companies would rather hire a college graduate with a welding inspectors license who never worked as a welder but has an engineering degree.

IF you worked as a welder (3 years minimum required)) and passed the exam, you were 2nd choice at best, after all of the engineering students.

There needs to be some kind of separation. Engineers also sign off the welding certificate exams.

[motogrady]

Continuing Education

Don't ya love it Shiney?.

That was messed up Lucky1, getting you for 1300.
I just don't know what the world is coming to.

My 2 biggest bitches lately, Freon and Obama Care.

R22, the green stuff, the stuff almost all of us use, 500 dollars for a 30 pound jug.
2 years ago, maybe 100, last year 150, this year 500.
And 80% of it is reclaimed stuff they buy from you for, get this, 25 cents a pound.
And they don't have a replacement freon for under 200, half of which needs you to change the oil in the systems compressor.  It's nuts.

Obama, a slickster for sure.
I try to refrain from the political stuff,
but I laughed upon hearing he's delayed the requirement for business that employ more than 50
people to offer coverage until 2015.  
That so many have written in saying hey, we will lay off till we have 49 employees.
What, pray tell, besides the mid term elections, is gonna be different in 2015?
 

[Truck]

Shiney, you forget our gov. already has been running a healthcare system.  Ask any vet how thats been working out for the last 50 years or so.

[Lucky 1]

I am a vet and I can tell you that the VA thing does not work unless maybe you were a 20 year man.

I went t the VA and they processed me and gave me a nice plastic card with american flag on it with my photo.

But when I signed in to get an appointment they said it would take 90 days.
I waited. Then about a week before the appointment I got a letter saying it would be delayed another 90 days.
I got 10 of those letters 90 days apart!

So I went to my county health dept. I showed the letters to my doctor. The doctor said, "We take care of most of the veterans."

[Lucky 1]

This is a replacement hot water heater, NOT a new installation.

Most of the requirements have been met and the requirements that are new
we have met, except the ones that would not be compatible.

We added the ground wire between the hot and cold water pipe.
That was missing because it is a new rule.

[free2ride]

Ain't new rules grand. because my wife runs an in-home day care our furnace has to be inspected every year. No big deal.

Except a couple of years ago the gov't decided that every furnace should have some . . . I don't even know. Something different. For how many years furnaces worked without the wire or whatever. But now they have to have them. If it weren't for the fact that I have a friend in the business they'da red tagged the furnace on the spot. Instead, I managed to get a couple of weeks to get a new one./

Merry Christmas to us that year -- a furnace -- just what we had wanted

[LukeM]

Our water heater needed to be replaced a while back.  It uses a powered vent system. Cost of the heater was just over $1000. Labor to install it and remove the old one: $150.  Me not burning the house down and saving his back not hauling a big steel can from the basement:  priceless.

Luke M

[cdaiscool]

Holy cow. I'm so glad I'm in IT; my bosses pay for my continuing education.

And the home is decent enough, where things aren't even that old and things are holding together just fine.

[seestheday]

I love that ifixit banner, specifically the bit about if you can't fix it you don't own it.  I'm going to check out that site.  

Man, the American government system sounds so messed up.  Makes the Canadian system sound so simple and straightforward.  Don't get me wrong, we have our issues (long gun registry debacle plus many others), but they all seem to pale in comparison to the convoluted mess of laws and regulations I seem to always hear about on forums.

[shinyribs]

I hear ya Sees'. Don't think that me and Crys haven't mentioned Canada before. We just really enjoy warm weather,though.

[free2ride]

hey, it's warm here occasionally. July 18th this year.

[seestheday]

ugh, ya that heat wave sucked.  I was camping and my dogs aren't used to the heat.  They just started puking because of it, so I knew it was time to pack up - yes they had water, were in the shade, and I took them for constant swims, but it didn't matter when they're not acclimated and it's 36C/96F but feels like 40C/104F in the shade (because of the humidity).

Shiney, moving to Canada may not be as easy as you think depending on your qualifications .  If you're at all serious, you would have to go through the same process as a Mexican or Canadian moving to the US and wanting to work.  When I worked in the states I came through on a TN VISA and got through fairly easily because of my Physics degree.  My wife wasn't able to work when I was there though, which sucked.  I also had to renew it annually (I believe it's on a 3 year renewal now).