Preparing DOHC CB750 for lengthy travel

[shinyribs]

Thats good advice Thorby! Around here the local filling station is our unofficial lost and found. If you see something laying in the road you pick it up and drop it off at the store. I've found plenty of my belongings in the store through the years

I'm just picking on ya Craig. I know how bust life can get. And like Thorby said,we all have those oops moments. I dropped a bike once forgetting to put down the kickstandThats as dumb as it gets.

Chain pics. "Where's the beef?"Both 530's. One is an o-ring so it is naturally wider to contain the o-rings,but you can still see the difference in the thickness of the plates.The little chain was an RK which is not a junky chain.It was just undersized for the application.

[cdaiscool]

Wow, okay, yeah that's definitely a larger chain. Where'd you get it from, and what's it cost?

I suppose I better order one after all....

Meanwhile, going to ride on this chain until I get the new one in. I'll get pics in a little while of the rear sprocket. I suppose this means I also better start working to replace the lost tools. Over $100 in all

[cdaiscool]

Thorby wrote

We need to get into the habit of never laying anything at all on the bike without strapping it tight.

This was off the back of my pick-up. It was dark, so I didn't see the tailgate down. I use the tailgate as a workbench since I back the truck in, and I'm working in a driveway in a trailer park. Thankfully the neighbors don't care that I'm working on the bike.

I did lose a gas can though that I was testing. I had it bungee'd down, and somewhere over 100 miles it either came off, or at a house I was looking at (I looked at 4 this day) it was stolen. I'm pretty sure it was still on there when I left the last one, though, and discovered it when I got to my next destination. So apparently lesson learned is, 1 bungee cord on a gas can isn't sufficient. :/

[shinyribs]

The chain is sold as a Bikemaster brand. It is actually an RK also. This one was for the chop and needed 128 links so it was pretty pricey. It was right around $70-75 bucks. If I had bought it as an RK it would have been about twice that. 530 o-ring. The catch with the Bikemaster chains is none of them come with a clip style master link for the higher tensile chains. They come as rivet on. So you can expect to go ahead and order another master link for $5 unless you rock the riveted ones.


The 108 link chain on my stock bike was about $60.

[cdaiscool]

I found a local motorcycle shop that sells master links for $1 straight. Wonder if I could find 'em again, as they were in a nondescript warehouse. That's where I got the link that's on my chain now. The old one had fallen out and I had been riding on it without the clip holding it in. Talk about scaring the crap out of me...

I'm uploading a video of the bike. Forgot to get shots of the sprocket, so going to do that once the video's uploaded to Youtube. Then I'll link everything here.

Chain's lubed up, just waiting for it to set.

[cdaiscool]

Cheapest I'm finding a 108-link O-ring Bikemaster 530 chain is $72 after shipping; most companies appear to be $90+ though. Got a link?

Also, apparently I done goofed. I haven't gone through 'em all yet, but the big stuff I thought was missing, I had actually taken off the tailgate when I got to Harbor Freight. Apparently it DID make the trip after all! So I'm no longer mad about that. Just something to laugh about now. Whee!

Meanwhile, here's my walkaround video. Something happened, presumably to the upload, after the 1 minute mark and it loses sound. But you can get the gist of what's going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C4ebmqjPP4



Meanwhile, here's some shots of the bike.

The sprocket. I pulled the chain off the sprocket, but there's zero movement pulling the chain off the sprocket. I also checked the chain tension; I think it may be tight. It says to do between 5/8" and 1"; its at 3/4". I'm going to loosen it up to 1" before I drop it down.


The look with the bags (though they'll be under the seat, not over!):


Placement of the cigarette lighter. I haven't tested it on my phone yet though. Its also not as close as it seems to be to the header:


Gives you an idea of the spacing:


I absolutely love the pantina of this sissy bar. A mix of gold copper, green, and concrete (I think):


Its on both sides:

[shinyribs]

Sorry bud. I don't have a link for the chains I was picking them up local

[Thorby]

Good video.  Are you riding without rear turn signals or are they down while you work on the bike?  I'm curious because mine are messed up and I wonder how strict police are with "choppers" in the US.  I've been using my hand to signal "Right" to avoid a ticket.

1

cdaiscool wrote

Cheapest I'm finding a 108-link O-ring Bikemaster 530 chain is $72 after shipping; most companies appear to be $90+ though. Got a link?

Also, apparently I done goofed. I haven't gone through 'em all yet, but the big stuff I thought was missing, I had actually taken off the tailgate when I got to Harbor Freight. Apparently it DID make the trip after all! So I'm no longer mad about that. Just something to laugh about now. Whee!

Meanwhile, here's my walkaround video. Something happened, presumably to the upload, after the 1 minute mark and it loses sound. But you can get the gist of what's going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C4ebmqjPP4



Meanwhile, here's some shots of the bike.

The sprocket. I pulled the chain off the sprocket, but there's zero movement pulling the chain off the sprocket. I also checked the chain tension; I think it may be tight. It says to do between 5/8" and 1"; its at 3/4". I'm going to loosen it up to 1" before I drop it down.


The look with the bags (though they'll be under the seat, not over!):


Placement of the cigarette lighter. I haven't tested it on my phone yet though. Its also not as close as it seems to be to the header:


Gives you an idea of the spacing:


I absolutely love the pantina of this sissy bar. A mix of gold copper, green, and concrete (I think):


Its on both sides:

[cdaiscool]

No rears, only fronts. As long as you signal, you're fine. I use hands to signal mine.

I'd prefer to have turns, actually, but the right-side fell off (bolt wiggled loose) and it looked goofy with only the left side on there.




In other news, I forgot how much I hate my saddle bags. All leather going across the top, and that's enough to prevent the seat from just nicely lining up in holes. And I gotta do this again?!?!?!? Holy hell.

[cdaiscool]

Yay, bike is officially wrapped up for the time being.

-Saddle bags are attached. However, in the process, I stripped out the holes that hold the seat on. Again. I've got bolts in 'em, and they're not going to work themselves loose, but I've got to work another solution up. The leather from the bags prevents the seat from coming down all the way. Plus, lining up 4 things (including seat bracket) is a PITA.

-Chain is 1" slack on center stand. I torqued it down to 75 ft lbs, but its a 3/8" wrench, then a 3/8-1/2 adapter, then 1/2" socket. So its probably closer to 68 or 70 ft lbs. But its still within tolerances, so I'll take it.

-Official list of lost tools from tailgate incident: 1 10mm socket. Though it could still be in the back of the truck. SO, SO glad it wasn't worse. I thought I'd lost several large tools plus my torque wrench. Found 'em in the back of the truck. Apparently I moved them from tailgate to back of truck, and then lost my mind.

I'm ordering up a new chain tomorrow. Not going to get new sprockets; these ones are fine, I think. I know you're supposed to replace them, but they only have 3,000 miles on them and the chain isn't eating it up since I keep up on adjustments. I've called my dad, and am going to his house this upcoming weekend (a week from today) to fix the seat/engineer a new solution and to put the new chain on. Probably do an oil change at that time as well, as he has a jack for motorcycles that we can use. Plus, with a little luck, we will be able to go for a ride before I leave this time. Wanted to last time, but it didn't happen.

Will get current pics tomorrow, if its not raining. Wasn't supposed to until 3 am per my weather app, but it started tinkling down a tad as I wrapped up outside. Its like it was warning me not to take it for a ride. Because I was considering it...

[shinyribs]

Good deal I couldn't really see the pics earlier today cuz my phone is poo,but that sissy bar is Suh-Weet!!! I dig it!

[cdaiscool]

I actually got it from half-caf a while ago (March? April? of this year!) but it didn't fit. Well, when I got the sissy bar mounting kit, I realized it was an excellent spacer. It just happened to line up well. Kind of.

I had to invert the holders for the bar, which looks odd, but I don't care. I'm not building this bike to be a show bike. Its purely a function > form build.

I should probably wash it though. Hmm.

[cdaiscool]

So, the tensile strength of the chain I got last Spring is 7200 lbs. That, I was told and saw online, should have been strong enough for the bike. Obviously it wasn't (or I got a poorly-cast chain) and as a result, am upgrading.

I e-mailed the vendor about it the other day:

Email to Company wrote

I purchased a chain on May 1, 2012 (order #2550596) as well as
sprockets for my 1981 CB750K. I was under the impression, based on
research and such, the chain had the proper tensile strength for this
bike. Per your site, it has an average tensile strength of 7,280 lbs
(link to product in their store).

However, In the 3,000 miles or so I've put on the bike (I've tracked
them via Fuelly, and know it hasn't been more -
http://www.fuelly.com/driver/cdaiscool/cb750k) this chain has
stretched quite considerably. Every 200 - 400 miles, I've had to
readjust it. I'm planning a trip in several weeks which should
encompass 3-5,000 miles, and quite frankly do not trust this chain to
perform. With a best case scenario being a chain flying off, and worse
case scenario being a locked rear wheel and dumping me on the ground
at 60, 70 mph I've decided I need to get a different chain.

If possible, I would like to get either a credit towards a different
chain or a refund of some sorts on this chain. I feel as though this
chain, while having a great record on your site, has not performed to
its full potential. I feel a different chain will be a much better
performer.

If you have any questions or concerns, feel free to message me. I
would like to resolve this asap, as I am looking to purchase today or
tomorrow, and am hoping to have a new chain in hand by Friday. I thank
you for your consideration, and I hope you have an excellent day.

Nearly end-of-day today, I received this back:

Reply Back! wrote

Craig,

The chain you purchased is a really good chain and we sell a lot to motocross guys who abuse them more than street riders.
They will need to be adjusted a couple time after your first few rides.  Now...you're not over tightening the chain are you?  You do need to keep a little slack in it to accommodate the sag of the suspension when you sit on it.

The chain doesn't sound defective, so we wouldn't be able to return it or give you a refund, but we would be willing to take 5% off the next chain you purchase.

Thanks,

And my reply thus far:

Replied to their reply wrote

While I appreciate the 5% off, I already ordered from my local company. I adjust it per the specs in the FSM-1" while bike is on centerstand.

While I understand the first couple rides, but when I have to adjust it, ride 300 miles, and readjust (which is 1 day riding for me sometimes) time and time again, that tells me there's a defect. I am not even hard on the chain; I only ride to and from destinations. I've never even done a burn out or a wheelie on any bike. So stretching to the point that it is loose, with 2+ inches of slack, doesn't sound good. Especially after only 300 miles.

Motocross bikes are very light bikes; a CB750 has quite a bit of torque and weight. So that's possibly why. Either way, I still believe this chain is no where near the tensile strength advertised. Quite possibly is an individual chain issue, and most of these chains are good. But this particular one is not.

So, apparently the stretching that happens all the time is not a defect, and because motocross users that have quite light bikes use this chain, it OBVIOUSLY isn't overrated or defective. Got it. :/

Oh well. At least its only $45 down the tubes. I figured I'd try to get my money back, since I don't think it was an error on my part. Even my local shop told me a 7200 tensile strength chain would be strong enough when I asked 'em if they had any chains in stock for my bike. So it's gotta be the chain...

[shinyribs]

That dude has bad logic IMO. MX bikes are also running in dirt. Knobbies can hook pretty good,but a sticky tire on pavement works a chain much harder than and knobby in dirt.

Oh well,at least you tried. I'm with you on the torque and weight of these bikes. I think they work chains harder than the average 750 cc bike.

[cdaiscool]

I think he's just trying to come up with some good reason why he wouldn't refund it.

I'm going to keep working on it. Its a quite popular store, so I don't want to bad mouth a usually good company. But offering a 5% discount for issues with a possibly defective, possibly over-hyped chain is ridiculous.

I'll shop here when necessary, but it won't be a first choice.

[rrgunslinger]

 

This would need to be performed with the chain off the bike. If you chain is out of service then he should replace it.

 

How to - Check Your Chain for Wear

Measure chain wear. Place a 12 inch ruler along the bottom chain run, align the 0 mark with the center of a chain rivet. Note where the 12 inch mark aligns on a rivet. If the center or the rivet is at 12 inches the chain is new or nearly new. Off by less than 1/16" and the chain is showing some wear but is still serviceable. If it misses the 12 inch mark by more than 1/16" the chain requires replacement and the rear cogs should be closely inspected. Worn cogs on a new chain will typically cause the chain to jump or skip in the worn out cogs.

On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 12:45 AM, cdaiscool [via Honda CB750'S] <[hidden email]> wrote:

I think he's just trying to come up with some good reason why he wouldn't refund it.

I'm going to keep working on it. Its a quite popular store, so I don't want to bad mouth a usually good company. But offering a 5% discount for issues with a possibly defective, possibly over-hyped chain is ridiculous.

I'll shop here when necessary, but it won't be a first choice.

Turbos, Hondas, 4-bangers, what could go wrong?

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://honda-cb750-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/Preparing-DOHC-CB750-for-lengthy-travel-tp4031695p4033148.html

To start a new topic under Member's Builds - A place to share your current project., email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from Honda CB750'S, click here.
NAML

[cdaiscool]

Okay, that's seriously cool. I didn't know that was a good test. Thanks boss! I'm going to do that when I replace the chain this weekend (if I can get it replaced then). I just ordered that Amazon chain, and sent an e-mail to my local shop cancelling my order. $64 vs $107 + shipping is just too big of a gap to 'buy local'. I'll take pictures of the chain for them, and hope they respect that it is indeed bad.

I hope it does somehow magically show up by Friday though. Otherwise I've gotta do it at my house, and I don't really want to do it in a driveway in a trailer park. Plus I don't have any way to remove links, which I know I'll have to (I did before).

[Piute]

   Removing links any Ole drill right size bit of course or in a pinch a file Ya only need to take off the roll over lip then punch it threw,

    You sell me junk ,I don't buy anything no more and tell others what junk you sell like Vintage 750 sold me a JUNK gators lasted about 6-8 months,So when buy expect that amount of time,That chain Expect that amount of miles,Not the seller what he is selling ,they have to stop selling junk.Let them no that it is junk.

[cdaiscool]

Yeah. Once I have the pictures done, I will send them to the company. I still think this chain was a defective chain, and if they refuse to do anything I will just escalate it.

The money in the chain is a day's riding worth of gas for me. So its in my interest to get this resolved.

On Dec 5, 2012 7:59 PM, "Piute [via Honda CB750'S]" <[hidden email]> wrote:

   Removing links any Ole drill right size bit of course or in a pinch a file Ya only need to take off the roll over lip then punch it threw,

    You sell me junk ,I don't buy anything no more and tell others what junk you sell like Vintage 750 sold me a JUNK gators lasted about 6-8 months,So when buy expect that amount of time,That chain Expect that amount of miles,Not the seller what he is selling ,they have to stop selling junk.Let them no that it is junk.

                            1977 CB750 F2 Super Sport
<LET THOSE WHO RIDE DECIDE><RIDE TO LIVE-LIVE FOR JESUS> 
Native American from central Cal,  Kickstand down in S.W.Missouri,
                                       
 

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://honda-cb750-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/Preparing-DOHC-CB750-for-lengthy-travel-tp4031695p4033195.html

To unsubscribe from Preparing DOHC CB750 for lengthy travel, click here.
NAML

[motogrady]

A straight chain will always wear and need adjustment more so than an oring.
Dirt get's all thru a straight chain, in the rollers, between the plates.
They need much more care.
They need lube.
Like ball joints or kingpins in a car, you don't grease 'em they fail.
Yes, it's a hassle, it get's all over the rim and swingarm, it's messy.
But if you don't lube them, and take them off and clean them in a pan of kerosene
every now and then, thats abuse of equipment.
The reason most MXers use the straights is they are lighter
and have less hp robbing drag than an oring.
But they clean and lube them all the time.  Or should.
That shot of the rear sprocket looked nice and clean, but awful dry to me.

A 250cc dirtbike might put out 30hp and weigh 250 lbs.
Your bike puts out at maybe 80hp and weighs in at around 600 lbs.
Do the math.

45 bucks for a chain, everyone knows that's dirt cheap.
The local bike shop and the guys that work there can usually be helpful and a good
bunch of people.  You do what you want.  But don't think for one minute they won't
know what's going on when you bring in a streched straight chain with no chain lube on it,
and you are standing there saying you want your money back.

Make enough noise, yea, you'll get the money back.
They'll give it to you just to get rid of you.

Is that what you want?