1981 CB750K - Ruby - 90K km's

[seestheday]

Thanks for those Hoosier.  I do have the entire shop manual printed out and in a 3 ring binder on my workbench .

I also have a Haynes manual that I check as well.  I find that there is some stuff that is helpful in the Haynes manual (like the strong recommendation to clean thoroughly before starting the tear down).  I treat the FSM as the official source though, so if there are discrepancies, that is the one I tend to trust.

[Hoosier Daddy]

seestheday wrote

BTW, is there a trick to removing the cam holders?  I have one that is really stuck on there.

Unscrew the mounting bolts at lift them up, but not removed, just until the are free of the dowels that are in the bore at the mating surface, then you can rock the cap gently with those bolts, forward and back as well as side to side, while giving slight lifting pressure.

[seestheday]

Ah, ok.  So they're still screwed in a little bit?  I'll give that a try tonight.

Also - I found a fantastic instructional on how to remove the head with very detailed pics on the other dohc forum (pm me for a link, I never know about etiquette on this sort of thing).  From it I found that I was missing one of my oil diverters.  I only had one of the big ones on my intake cam, and two very small ones on my exhaust cam.

I will be calling honda soon to see if I can get a new one, but am curious, what kind of problems would that cause?  The missing oil diverter might have been the source of the rubber I found in my oil pan...

[Hoosier Daddy]

No, not screwed in at all, completely loosened, free from the threads, and lifted past the alignment dowels (about 1/2" above the deck). Or another way of putting it, if you have to bolt out in your hand, you are just sticking them half way in the caps hole to use as a lever.

[seestheday]

Interesting.  I am worried about bending the bolts or ruining the threads doing that.  I'll try to be gentle though.  No time to work on it last night.  Should be able to dive back in tonight.

[Hoosier Daddy]

I wouldn't blame you to wait for someone else to chime in, that is how I do it, and learned on good old car engines tha have steel main / rod bearing caps. I think there is a "Feel to it" and had resevations even suggesting it. Also I doubt you would damage the steel bolt, but more apt to damage the aluminum cap first (I'd rather bend a bolt!) Notice some of the caps have threaded holes in the center for the valve cover ? The same bolts you remove from the cap can screw into tose center holes and be used as a handle. but not all of the caps have them.
 NOTE: either is better than hitting it with a hammer  

[seestheday]

Damn these are stuck tight.

2 have threaded holes that I can put the cover bolt into.  I wrapped a rag around the bolt head so I could get a really good grip on it and pulled so hard I was lifting the engine up.  Worked it back and forth, no movement at all.

Sprayed some liquid wrench everywhere I could think it might be sticking and still nothing.  I will try again tonight.

[shinyribs]

Are you talking about the caps that hold the cam into the head? The half-circle saddle clamps? Wow,hard to believe they are THAT stuck! Good luck,and proceed w/caution.

[Hoosier Daddy]

 

seestheday wrote

... pulled so hard I was lifting the engine up...

DAY-UM!

[seestheday]

Yep, those clamps. Super stuck. Tried again tonight , three are on there super tight. I sprayed more liquid wrench, bit it can't really soak in it because it will run down past where I believe it is sticking (on the dowels). I'm tapping the covers with a piece of wood because I figure that is like hitting it with a hammer, but safe. Still nothing. Next I guess I'll try heat?

[seestheday]

Ha, yes I was using a dead lift technique to handle the weight. Straight back, lift with the legs!

[LukeM]

Etiquette, shmetiquette.  I don't think anyone here would mind a posting from another forum, especially if it helps out a fellow rider/builder.  Go for it.

Luke M

[Hoosier Daddy]

Sounds like a green light coming from the Admin bud.

[seestheday]

Here you go: http://www.cb750c.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=11804

[Hoosier Daddy]

I am Hoosier_Daddy there.
Franks "How-to's" are epic posts!
Genesound is a good guy too... his document library is fantastic and gave me permission to link to them over here.
Other than that, all I'll say is... I like it here MUCH better.

[seestheday]

Ya, I am actually getting some great advice there right now and have seen some of your posts there.  That said, I agree with you about the people and the vibe...  Gene and some others are great, but some people...

Then there is the f site...  It's like a weird gradation.  F site has lots of great info, but God forbid you don't have an f or don't already know what you are doing.

This place its great.  Most of the old timers are honestly sohc guys, but are still very happy to help with dohc models.  Considering that there are a lot of differences, that is pretty cool.  This place also seems very cool about clueless people like I was a year ago.  I couldn't have gotten to where I am now without this place.

[Piute]

   I have sent others there ,I just peek when I google a ? and sends me there.

[seestheday]

With the help of Gene from the cb750c site I was able to get my camshaft covers off: http://cb750c.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=21907

[shinyribs]

The link doesn't seem to work for non-members. I don't currently own a DOHC,but may someday. I'd be interested in what ended up working for you.

[Hoosier Daddy]

Like I said, "Genesound" is one of the good guys.

genesound wrote

OK, tap them back down so they are completely seated where they are supposed to be and we'll start over..
 
They are a pretty tight fit in the dowel pins, they are supposed to be. Then a little corrosion gets in there because you ride in the rain, and they stick, especially if you've been running with your valve cover grommets in less than perfect condition, so some of your water problem might be getting in right there. Make sure all those gaskets and grommet are like new and properly sealed, but I digress...
 
It's easy to get the caps cocked a little sideways when trying to remove them and they bind. Using more force then only gouges up the aluminum, the aluminum galls more and they only bind tighter.
 
I find rubber hammers useless for this. They don't provide enough shock, and are usually too heavy and encourage hitting the cap too hard. Instead, I use a small ball peen hammer. Pull straight up on the cap, gently tapping the cap on one end (hammer tapping toward the other side), then the other. You should be able to feel it slightly move. It will usually move on only one side at a time, and once one side moves, then start gently tapping on the other side, all the time pulling straight up on the cap with your other hand. It should wiggle back and forth all the way up. The key is to use the minimum tapping and pulling necessary to get it to move on one side then the other and not bind. It's the binding that is stopping it from coming off.
 
If all that still comes to naught, try filling the bolt hole and dowel with a decent rust cutting penetrating oil, right through the cam cap bolt hole in the top of the cap. Let it sit a while (hour or so), then try again. I like Kroil or PB Blaster or such for this, but even WD or even kerosene would probably help. I'd probably try to remove most of the penetrating oil before starting over just to save on mess.
 
Don't ever try to just force these though. You're not doing yourself any favors in so doing.

"Holeysmokes" on the other hand is always a DICK, he just can't seem to help it... his only comments in that thread were absolutely worthless to your issue. Totally non-value added, just trying to make you look like a fool. GAWD he pisses me off.
  I knew someone would tell you to hit them with a hammer. Sometimes it's neseccary but I wasn't going to suggest it. Glad you got them off though, Congrats!
Just be sure to Plasti guage them when you re-assemble to see if you distorted them.

Sorry for the rant.