CB650 SC Oil Cooler for CB750's

[shinyribs]

TOOLS1 wrote

It will not bolt onto the CB 750. The CB 750 has a protrusion that the bolt goes into. This creats a space between the case, and the adapter. However my buddy, and I are working on this problem right now. He is wanting to adapt a DOHC oil cooler/filter can onto his CB 750, and I want to use a remote oil filter on Mortal Vindication. I picked up a length of 4" X 1/2" wall aluminum pipe, and we are having spacers made. They will have the grove, for the o-ring on the case side, and a flat on the adapter side.
TOOLS

Sarge and Piute. I know y'alls research is good,but Id probably hold off until the Toolmiester gets this sorted out on the one he is doing right now. You know,it's hard to be beat real world,hands on knowledge.Apparently something is just not fitting right. Lots of difference between the SOHC's and DOHC's.

[Piute]

  All the reseach I've done nobody has got it RIGHT aparently,but can be done,I could post endless bad results from other trying ,I know TOOLS can do it and sure other have to but just havn't found there posting / review,
   Stared cause I was going to buy a plate from "X" was digging for reviews and ran across this Idea,SO srg.posted the thought I had also.Seem TOOLS too.
  My next oil change is .....3rd wk of May..I'll check that plate N bolt then,I change my oil to much to worry but would be nice to see high pressure always,by the way will that pressure gauge just screw in from "X" havn't got my answer from them yet.

[sgtslag]

X's adapter is very similar to mine:  it has two ports on one side of the adapter, so you can install either a pressure sensor, or a temperature sensor.  Most gauges have a remote sensor; they are either electrical senders (resistance varies according to pressure/temperature, and gauge reads the resistance, translated into PSI/Degrees F), or mechanical, Bourdain Tubes, which translate the pressure/temperature into hydraulic pressure, which mechanically moves the needle on the gauge.

The electrical gauge requires a single wire, which you have to supply, between the sending unit, which screws into the hole in the adapter on the engine, next to the radiator hose (the mechanical sensor screws in, also).  The Bourdain Tube needs to be run up to the gauge, without bending/kinking it, which destroys the whole gauge unit.  The mechanical gauges typically have a 270-degree needle deflection (typically 4% accuracy, in their specs. -- only requires power for the backlight, if you need it); the electrical gauges typically have a 90-degree needle deflection, but the same range of temperature/pressure, so much less accurate to read, and they require good electrical connections to function.  They both will work, it is just a matter of preference.

Sunpro gauges (which is what I use) come with the adapters needed, to fit into the holes on the adapter.  Don't know if other brands include the adapters, or not.  Cheers!

[OpTiCz]

Well, what's the verdict?
Did you get this working?

[Piute]

   Well
OpT. The oil cooler Idea Had To be put back for myself ,Due to th fact My bike is the only trans-po I got and can't be experimenting Now Ya-No ,
  As far as the gauge just found one couple wk's ago and been Doing the Touring thing to bike,Will be July before I can get parts needed for adopter on it,
   Well Sir Just got this (few wk's)just no right time  at 50+hr's at work and 90+ deg.now.
   But will post this mount and oil cooler (my build) wonted temps before and after install,
   (temp gage returned wrong 1).

 Description said Harley Yeah right show me a H.D. that get more then 60lb's
       (this 100 lb's liquid filled)

[sgtslag]

For posterity's sake, I had to edit my earlier posting about the Nighthawk's cooling system.  The adapter plate has a hole in it, which allows some oil to pass directly to the filter, without being cooled; it also mixes cooled oil with un-cooled oil, within the adapter.  This mixing is similar to what is done in the 900C's oil pan.

Piute, I am really looking forward to hearing how your Nighthawk adaptation pans out.  Glad to see you are installing an oil temperature gauge (before, and after, readings are da' bomb!)  -- it is the only way to really know what the cooler is doing for your engine...  Cheers!

[TOOLS1]

I had a 5/8" adapter ring machined, for my Buddies. Fits perfect.
TOOLS

[rrgunslinger]

Talking about motor oil.  Here's a read if you are so inclined. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine_oil

 

On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 1:27 PM, sgtslag [via Honda CB750'S] <[hidden email]> wrote:

For posterity's sake, I had to edit my earlier posting about the Nighthawk's cooling system.  The adapter plate has a hole in it, which allows some oil to pass directly to the filter, without being cooled; it also mixes cooled oil with un-cooled oil, within the adapter.  This mixing is similar to what is done in the 900C's oil pan.

Piute, I am really looking forward to hearing how your Nighthawk adaptation pans out.  Glad to see you are installing an oil temperature gauge (before, and after, readings are da' bomb!)  -- it is the only way to really know what the cooler is doing for your engine...  Cheers!

1979 CB750K
1993 Kawasaki Voyager XII

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://honda-cb750-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/CB650-SC-Oil-Cooler-for-CB750-s-tp3909678p4023645.html

To start a new topic under Honda CB750'S, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from Honda CB750'S, click here.
NAML

[Piute]

  I havn't sent this oil dipstick temp.gage back yet to Tiwain,(monday will be off)SO i was thinking I'd check it's temperture right when I get home,IF it will reach the oil(like 2" below cap is full)the threads are wrong why return(PAUL says rethread)I'd like to rubber cork it like A Harley(Hell  with the threads).But they gave me my 40 bucks back already.

[sgtslag]

I like that gauge.  It is definitely made for engine oil, with the red zone starting at 250 F.  Too bad you couldn't adapt it to fit.  Good luck with your search for a replacement.  Cheers!

[Piute]

   Will be 100 deg. today Hummidity add A teen for fill like  great test day

[rrgunslinger]

That's good you got your money back.  I ordered stuff from over there and sent it back but never got my money back.  Paypal nor ebay were any help.

On Thu, Jun 28, 2012 at 6:48 AM, Piute [via Honda CB750'S] <[hidden email]> wrote:

   Will be 100 deg. today Hummidity add A teen for fill like  great test day

                            1977 CB750 F2 Super Sport
<LET THOSE WHO RIDE DECIDE><RIDE TO LIVE-LIVE FOR JESUS> 
Native American from central Cal,  Kickstand down in S.W.Missouri,
                                     Titled N owned;
 6 Harley's,2 Honda's,2Kawasaki's,2 Triumphs,28 vehicle's
 I used and abused them all,But Triumph's sold before could
 NOT A mechanic,          Custom Auto Body N Paint by birth
     But am An Elc oholic                                  >STOCK SUCKS<

                                                                                                   

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://honda-cb750-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/CB650-SC-Oil-Cooler-for-CB750-s-tp3909678p4023722.html

To start a new topic under Honda CB750'S, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from Honda CB750'S, click here.
NAML

[Piute]

   What I do Slinger is ,1st tell them I trusted to get WHAT I THOUGHT WAS the part I paid for N was not,Since I trusted you by sending my CASH 1st, YOU SHOULD EITHER CREDIT MY PAY-PAL or right item that I thought I paid for,E-Bay excepts these terms and they have to respond to 1 of your choices.

   O.K. I put that temp gauge in was already at 100+ deg before putting in oil bagg,ROSE to 250+,Bike was/is parked in shade under tree now.In 3hrs total I'll check temp again.(130deg....)Air 99deg at 8:30 to dang hot
 An oil cooler is A must,I do know that the bike's gets hotter for a while after you turn it off from lack of moving air,(5min.to get temp plug in)Air temp at 107deg I believe I heard at work.
    So if this nightHawk cooler don't work I'll be getting one fo sho that will work.

[sgtslag]

I forget, Piute, are you running some type of synthetic oil?  The synthetics won't break down until the temperature gets up to 400 F, however, the seals, and gaskets, will still be damaged by anything over 250 F.  The synthetics will avoid carbon sludge, and they will function as a lubricant, and coolant, while the dino oils are just falling apart...  Thanks for the details on temperatures.  Data makes all the difference.  Cheers!

[rrgunslinger]

Good question, anybody running synthetic in one of these bikes?  I want to but kinda of weary of what it might do to the seals. 

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 12:28 AM, sgtslag [via Honda CB750'S] <[hidden email]> wrote:

I forget, Piute, are you running some type of synthetic oil?  The synthetics won't break down until the temperature gets up to 400 F, however, the seals, and gaskets, will still be damaged by anything over 250 F.  The synthetics will avoid carbon sludge, and they will function as a lubricant, and coolant, while the dino oils are just falling apart...  Thanks for the details on temperatures.  Data makes all the difference.  Cheers!

1979 CB750K
1993 Kawasaki Voyager XII

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://honda-cb750-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/CB650-SC-Oil-Cooler-for-CB750-s-tp3909678p4023804.html

To start a new topic under Honda CB750'S, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from Honda CB750'S, click here.
NAML

[sgtslag]

Yes, I am:  Shell Rotella T6 Synthetic.  I've been running the T6 for over a year, in all of my vehicles, and my air compressor (needed to fill my son's tires in January, and the 30W would not even turn the pistons over...  the T6, 5W-40, spun them over easy!).  No problems whatsoever, especially in my '79 CB750K:  runs fantastic, starts super-easy, runs like a champ, no oil/seal issues at all.  Wal-Mart has the best price on the T6:  ~$21/gallon.  I even run it in my '75 Ford F100 truck, no oil/seal issues with it, either.

The T6 is rated "SN", for cars, in spite of it being a "diesel" oil.  It is higher in detergents, but that has not caused any issues.  The T6 does not have friction modifiers, so it is safe for all wet clutches...  If you search the Internet for "Shell Rotella T6 oil motorcycle", you will find many folks are running it in their motorcycles.  This search will unearth a wealth of comments on the topic.  Cheers!

[rrgunslinger]

Sounds good.  Think I will try it once I use up what I have.  Book call for 30W so I been using Valvoline 30W.  Good oil but I like Synthetic.

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 8:55 AM, sgtslag [via Honda CB750'S] <[hidden email]> wrote:

Yes, I am:  Shell Rotella T6 Synthetic.  I've been running the T6 for over a year, in all of my vehicles, and my air compressor (needed to fill my son's tires in January, and the 30W would not even turn the pistons over...  the T6 spun them over easy!).  No problems whatsoever, especially in my '79 CB750K:  runs fantastic, starts super-easy, runs like a champ, no oil/seal issues at all.  Wal-Mart has the best price on the T6:  ~$21/gallon.

1979 CB750K
1993 Kawasaki Voyager XII

---

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

http://honda-cb750-s.456789.n3.nabble.com/CB650-SC-Oil-Cooler-for-CB750-s-tp3909678p4023828.html

To start a new topic under Honda CB750'S, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from Honda CB750'S, click here.
NAML

[Piute]

sgtslag wrote

I forget, Piute, are you running some type of synthetic oil?  The synthetics won't break down until the temperature gets up to 400 F, however, the seals, and gaskets, will still be damaged by anything over 250 F.  The synthetics will avoid carbon sludge, and they will function as a lubricant, and coolant, while the dino oils are just falling apart...  Thanks for the details on temperatures.  Data makes all the difference.  Cheers!

   No fake stuff here YET,
 I'm using Valv.50wt. in Summer,Till I get this oil cooler thing figuard out,Then will go fake,I personaly don't like it but is better,I change my oil about once a month no-matter how many miles,filter every other change,(much faster and less mess).With Syn. in my El Camino at 1st leaked all over the place,All O.K. now,So I do know that it can get by the smallest holes(witch is great inside eng.)Elc. never leaked before.OR now(Damn timing covers gasket are a pain on A 350)


                                                       My Baby mouse

[shinyribs]

Do you know what it means when they call an oil ''synthetic''? The name is rather misleading. Synthetic oil is not truly synthetic,meaning it is not made of some super material that is superior to dino oil. Synthetic oil IS dino oil,it has just been synthesized. When the dino oil is synthesized it "aligns" the oil molecules. What it creates is an oil that is consistent throughout the entire volume of oil. All of the zinc,parafin...whatever else is in there...is not all clumped together in one area if the given volume of oil. Basically,it just blasts the particles apart. But synthetic oil contains all the original ingredients of whatever dino oil they manufacturer chose to zap. I'm sure there are studies showing that syn oil is waaay better then dino oil,and it most likely is. But I just dont understand the breakdown thing. How can one oil tolerate higher temp/sustained temps if it is all made of the same stuff???  I'm not argueing here, just never did understand it. Looks like all the particles would get whipped up good during engine operation. Maybe it doesn't. Or maybe what I have been told about syn oil was not accurate. Given this explanation of oil how would a syn blend be possible??Do they 'just zap it a little'? I really dont know.Just putting it out there. I tried to learn about syn vs dino oil when I first got into the drag racing scene and that is what was explained to me.

[sgtslag]

Actually, what you were told is not quite accurate.  There are five different types of oil:  Types I, II, III, IV, and V.  They are not made the same way.  Types I and II are similar, Type III is dino base oil run through a process called "hydrocracking", which is a chemical means of further refinement.  Type IV, as I understand it, is built up, chemically, one molecule at a time, so, No, it is not made from dino base oils, as I-III are.  Type V is a catch-all classification, which encompasses 'everything else', or all of the weird, special purpose oil types.

Take a look at automotive oil, on Wikipedia.org.  They have a very thorough article on the various types, and their differences.  It's a bit complex, but you will get something useful out of it, I believe.  To answer your question, No, they are not the same, and they have different boiling temperatures, different flashpoint temperatures, etc.  Cheers!